Interior Exterior
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Hahaha! Ignorance is truly bliss!
Well, so far we have seen one of the projects in your car, as far as I know. The heavy amplifier in the trunk with the shaky cantilever brackets tied into the taillight mounts. And the heavy sub that requires the passenger to pull their legs back and raise their knees. In a small airbag equipped car that just may be unsafe. Don't shoot the messenger. I've seen problems caused by more subtle stuff over time. So besides personal attacks, and questionable bling-bling mods what have you to share with your fellow Elisetalkers?
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of all the preachers on this board i don't think stan is one of them. so you are probably pointing your finger at the wrong person, but you're allowed to think/post what you want.
Seconded. There aren't many people here that have consistently done so much to build the knowledge base that is Elisetalk other than Randy. So if you want to refute his information, fine. If you want to ignore it, fine. But don't tell him to stop posting 'cause many of us like reading his posts. I don't see that most of the complainers have done anything for the community.
I seriously don't understand all the attitude here. It's not like he's personally called you on the phone and told you that your family is ugly. He's just questioning the benefits of some relatively undocumented perfomance add-ons. Add-ons that none of you (except maybe Brett) have any kind of financial interest in. So why all the personal indignation?
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Any aerodynamic device, front or rear that is not adjustable is just bling.
Any aerodynamic device that comes without any performance data or any evidence of any wind tunnel work isn't even an aerodynamic device. It's an unknown.
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Any aerodynamic device, front or rear that is not adjustable is just bling.
I consider the rear diffuser to be more than "just bling".
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I have not evaded any questions regarding the products I sell Tim. <...>
I have answered the posts on the LED's as well as the throttle body to the best of my ability?
Bret... We asked specifically if the LEDs met the federal regulations - we were told that the "met" the California laws (which are only a subset of the federal regulations). We specifically asked about the off-angle (specifically 45 degree angle) brightness and you stopped posting.
I'm not trying to attack you personally, and I understand that you have a business to run. But you do seem to have plenty of time to post the "I have a new wonderful product", and never quite answer serious questions...
Yep, I'm a hard audience, but I do try to ask valid technical questions...
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I consider the rear diffuser to be more than "just bling".
Sorry, I thought that it was understood that we were speaking about aftermarket parts.
Don't really have any information to critique Lotus' aerodynamic work.
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Look, if you don't like my posts or whatever, fine. This is not my site, I am not affiliated with it, and I do not sell anything here. I have a great deal of car experience of different kinds and over a long period of time. I've done all sorts of car projects, although my Elise is the most stock car I've ever had, since I run it in a stock class. I have multiple technical degrees and have taught myself just tons of other stuff. If you don't like to hear what some have posted here feel free to research the particular topic at hand or listen to others or figure it out for yourself. In this case aerodynamic add ons and how they affect a car. There is lots of relevant material out there for your perusal and trials.
Much of this stuff is basic to ANY car. Such as the E30 M3 example I provided. I have one and it is a wonderful driving machine, hard core like the Elise. It's aero stuff works, works well, and is safe, won't break off needs no design effort to install, etc.
Brett says that he'll look into the information the Elise wing designer / mfg may have. It may very well be along the lines of what others have requested. Maybe the results are pretty good, if they are the parts must be used in the exactly the same way they were designed for and tested. That is not possible right now since Brett does not have this information and it may or may not exist. In the mean time things like: "This carbon fiber piece is the ultimate in style and function" are posted about it on the sales site. Well let's hear about the function some more. It also seems like some are designing, building, and installing reinforcing mounts and accomodations for the part. Maybe things like that could come with the part? From his site it looks like at least two wings are offered...how about more information on each?
Drive my car like I mean it? I do all the time..I've got 27,000 miles on it and about 2-4 autocrosses a month since I got it (when it's not Winter). First one = 4 days after I got it, had to run in 2nd / 3rd gear to keep the Rs down. In the last month or so codriving with National Champ drivers in my Elise, I was 0.4 seconds slower than one, and 0.3 seconds behind the other. How about you?
Nitron shocks. Who do you think worked closely with Ohlins in developing their Federal Elise shocks? And the SCCA version of it? The shocks that various vendors are now selling? Right...me, way back last year and early this year. I've been involved with several other products now sold for the car, or was copied. Anyone running BMW wheels bolts, you're welcome. I found the K&N air filter that fit the car through trial and error, not by clicking to order one. Oil filter cross references. ABS Ice mode data some are now using. Detailing mods. Pedal mods that work and cost nothing, some of which are now in the Service Manual. Lots, and lots of other actual hands on examples. Your turn.
.........I returned my Ohlins and went for the Nitrons easier to adjust, higher spring rates, going higher still. Parking Lots are great if you like that sort of thing I've done it,thought it was a bore. Waiting to drive around cones. I'd rather drive through a canyon.
Why buy a car with so much potential and limit it to stock....Trial and error
is what made racing evolve and trickel down to road cars. I don't know Brett or most of the venders on Elise Talk, some know their stuff and others are just winging it. I'm happy for all the people with BMW Wheel bolts but if one should ever fail, not being factory they can thank you...Hey I'm 55 and you sound like you could be my dad....Lighten up...We're playing with toys and you're taking the fun out of it.... PS...I know a thing or two also..........
read the letter from Bob Howe http://www.rs200.org/106.htm
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Sorry, I thought that it was understood that we were speaking about aftermarket parts.
Where does that leave aftermarket non-adjustable diffusers?
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This thread has made me want an Exige.
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its just like the damn motorsilk thing...some of us want evidence before we buy something, others dont seem to care...some need to go personal....
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Where does that leave aftermarket non-adjustable diffusers?
The same place as the factory diffuser functional but way cooler. Check out Sector111
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I am anxious to see a PB wing in person and would be happy to post recommendations on mounting.
The fact that it does not come with precise mounting location instructions and appropriate mounting hardware boggles the mind and raises a very big red flag
I am not an expert but I would have thought that if it is mounted a few inches forward or backward that the areo properties will be changed.
I have no idea what this thing costs but I am sure it is real money. You should not have to go down to Home Depot after you get your wing and hope it does not fall off on the way home
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For the guys needing more information regarding the wing, if wind tunnel testing was done, what the downforce numbers are etc, I have emailed Stefano at PB Racing about the details. As soon as I hear back from him I will post the information here in this thread. Thanks guys.
I just took a look at PB Racing site,
for what concern the carbon wing (under News) ;
CARICO 130 Kg at about 160/170 kmh
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What does that mean?
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I just took a look at PB Racing site,
for what concern the carbon wing (under News) ;
CARICO 130 Kg at about 160/170 kmh
The plot thickens...
So 286 lbs on the boot lid at just over 100 MPH...
What do you think would happen to the boot lid if two average sized people stood on it I don't think I need a bunch of letters after my name to figure that one out
I wonder what it would be at 130MPH
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Valid point, but 286 .lbs seems very optimistic given the Exige's numbers. Either way, they've got a problem on their hands.
- J
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Valid point, but 286 .lbs seems very optimistic given the Exige's numbers. Either way, they've got a problem on their hands.
- J
......or someone has a problem on their trunklid, Donal!
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What are good numbers one might expect from a rear wing? 48 pounds doesn't sound like much really, unless you're at the breaking point of adhesion, then it sounds like a lot. Should we be expecting Jim Hall Chaparral numbers here? How many pounds would you think would be the 'worth it/ not worth it' number?
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This thread has made me want an Exige.
Agreed. This thread is a prime example of why I often hesitate to post anything that deviates from stock and without the 'Lotus blessing'. I guess I should have just mounted it, and gone about my merry way. I was actually somewhat proud of the installation, and thought maybe I could offer some trial-and-error insight to others in the market for one - seems that wan't the case. There appears to be some sort of ego-war waged here, and I don't see the point, nor am I impressed. Maybe it's time this thread did a disappearing act...
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What are good numbers one might expect from a rear wing? 48 pounds doesn't sound like much really, unless you're at the breaking point of adhesion, then it sounds like a lot. Should we be expecting Jim Hall Chaparral numbers here? How many pounds would you think would be the 'worth it/ not worth it' number?
Keep in mind that although 48 pounds of down force doesn't sound like much, most cars are actually generating significant lift at those speeds. Even the small amount of down force generated with a stock Elise is actually quite impressive.