A&Q about Lotus
Q:
I was wondering if changing in race pads (porterfield R4) for the track and then changing back to stock pads when off the track is okay. Will I have to re-bed in the street pads or re-bed in the track pads to the rotor surface every time I change?
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I changed to porterfields some time ago, we don't use up pads like other cars due. Too light for that. Hence, I've just left them on and have plenty of pad left.
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my limited understanding is that the pads/rotors wear and conform to eachother. this is why usually you change out pads and rotors at the same time on a brake job. i could be wrong. with this in mind, i would think that the wear in a track weekend on a set of rotors would not be enough to effect the set of streetpads that you removed, unless something goes very wrong as far as wear goes at the track.
i would think you should be fine, but make sure that you bed in the race pads the first session EVERY time you change them out. just take it slow and hit them hard for a few turns to begin with.
lets see if i have a clue at all, by the flames recieved or not. this is what i would do if it were my car anyway, and i would do this with a new set of pads and old rotors in my spec miata.
Fishguy
A:
Also, install the used pads in their original positions. For example, the outside left front pad should be put back in the outside left front position. This should minimize the variables a bit.
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make sure you bed the pads in each time. I used to do this in the miata I built before the Exige without adverse effects besides crappy wilwood calipers.
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Don't know if it's a must, but I scuff up the rotors, clean up the face of the pads and the rotor, reinstall in their original positions and bed them in every time... It's just how I was raised.
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Bedding process deposits brake compound molecules onto the rotor. Say that you are currently on your stock pads and rotors indicating that the stock rotors are "coated" with stock pad compound. It is actually the friction between the the pad and this deposit that stops the car. Now you would like to switch to another brake pad. In order for that brake pad to function effectivelly you need to bed it in - coat the rotors with the new pads molecules. However, your stock rotors have already been coated with the stock brake pad... This is where brake pad compatability comes into play. In order for the new brake pads to work they need to be compatible with the old ones. Otherwise, you must swap the rotors as well. Porterfield R4s are a carbon kevlar compound. I dont know about the stock pads. They would have to be carbon kevlar if you plan on switching back and forth. Otherwise, use the stock pads until they are gone and then make the switch to another brake compound.
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Interesting. I Googled "turning brake rotors" and got a couple of interesting articles. One said that according to GM you should only replace your rotors if there is some defect with them (eg. scored, too thin, cracked etc). Others said that you should always replace or turn your rotors when changing pads. What do you guys think about turning our rotors? I'm concerned that turning cross drilled rotors would weaken them and lead to worse heat dissipation.
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Originally Posted by catapult
Interesting. I Googled "turning brake rotors" and got a couple of interesting articles. One said that according to GM you should only replace your rotors if there is some defect with them (eg. scored, too thin, cracked etc). Others said that you should always replace or turn your rotors when changing pads. What do you guys think about turning our rotors? I'm concerned that turning cross drilled rotors would weaken them and lead to worse heat dissipation.
Turning the rotors basically dispaches the layer of the brake pad deposit that I mentioned above. That is a good solution as well. Still, I think the easiest thing to do is simply use brake pad compounds that are compatible...
A:
I do this on my TT. Autozone pads for the street. Carbotech for the track. I just keep track of the position of each pad (write with chalk on the back) and bed the pads with each change. Not a big deal.
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I have a set of Porterfield R4S pads on the alltrac and they have been holding up really well - I would probably just try and run them all the time and see how well they last.,
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I am with babak, the car is light and does not distroy the pads or the rotors like alot of other cars, leave them alone unless your putting a ton of miles on.
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Originally Posted by MitchT
I am with babak, the car is light and does not distroy the pads or the rotors like alot of other cars, leave them alone unless your putting a ton of miles on.
+2 when i tracked my elise the stcok brake were MORE than enough, and I could outbrake most anything on the track. i had the abs working , so i was on them hard.
A:
Originally Posted by fishguyAZ
+2 when i tracked my elise the stcok brake were MORE than enough, and I could outbrake most anything on the track. i had the abs working , so i was on them hard.
Sure, but I ran out of stock brakes, and the replacements are uber-expensive. What do you expect for a pad that works well and doesn't squeak?
For the same price, you can get two sets of pads. One that is very, very strong, and a milder low dust one.
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Originally Posted by CountTracula
Bedding process deposits brake compound molecules onto the rotor. Say that you are currently on your stock pads and rotors indicating that the stock rotors are "coated" with stock pad compound. It is actually the friction between the the pad and this deposit that stops the car. Now you would like to switch to another brake pad. In order for that brake pad to function effectivelly you need to bed it in - coat the rotors with the new pads molecules. However, your stock rotors have already been coated with the stock brake pad... This is where brake pad compatability comes into play. In order for the new brake pads to work they need to be compatible with the old ones. Otherwise, you must swap the rotors as well. Porterfield R4s are a carbon kevlar compound. I dont know about the stock pads. They would have to be carbon kevlar if you plan on switching back and forth. Otherwise, use the stock pads until they are gone and then make the switch to another brake compound.
This is good info. So, the question is, is there a streetable carbon kevlar pad (I am going to use the R4 for track only)? I know that the R4S is not quite as good as the stock pads.
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Originally Posted by FlyLo
Sure, but I ran out of stock brakes, and the replacements are uber-expensive. What do you expect for a pad that works well and doesn't squeak?
For the same price, you can get two sets of pads. One that is very, very strong, and a milder low dust one.
flylo, cost of things for my racedays is no longer that much of an issue for me. my rotors cost me $20 each, and pads are about $100. I have more spares than most part stores have instock now it seems.
I love racing the Spec Miata. Still no regrets, especially after spinning through the dirt last race at about 70 mph, that little miata is built tough.
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Originally Posted by fishguyAZ
flylo, cost of things for my racedays is no longer that much of an issue for me. my rotors cost me $20 each, and pads are about $100. I have more spares than most part stores have instock now it seems.
I love racing the Spec Miata. Still no regrets, especially after spinning through the dirt last race at about 70 mph, that little miata is built tough.
This is EliseTalk, not FlyinMiata.
My pads are currently $120/axle. I have "race" pads on the front and "autocross" on the rear. Just the occasional squeak. I expect them to last a very long time. Will do a full write up later.
P.S. I hate cross-drilled rotors. [/vent]
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Originally Posted by Dietrich
This is good info. So, the question is, is there a streetable carbon kevlar pad (I am going to use the R4 for track only)? I know that the R4S is not quite as good as the stock pads.
I think this is overkill. Just bed your pads properly each time you switch.
Or, consider using the R4 on the street. With plenty of spray and goo on the back of the pads, and a proper bedding, they might not squeak "much."
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Originally Posted by FlyLo
I think this is overkill. Just bed your pads properly each time you switch.
Or, consider using the R4 on the street. With plenty of spray and goo on the back of the pads, and a proper bedding, they might not squeak "much."
Well, somebody needs to try running R4 pads on the track and then on the street and note the pad wear as well as noise and dust levels. If that is acceptable, then no need to switch. I am pretty sure that R4 (race pad) will wear much faster on the street than the stock pad. I have a set that I will put in for the upcoming track day. I will try to leave them in for about 2 weeks afterwards and let you guys know of noise and dust issues, if any.
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I've run R4, and R4E on the street with no issues. It's fine.