A&Q about Lotus
Q:
Originally Posted by tandemracer
If more people had guns fewer cretins would try to steal cars.
Tell that to the Amish schoolkids gunned down by the Lawabiding milkman who owned quite a few legal guns.
I love guns but it is insane to let any idiot buy a 9mm or AR15
A:
Originally Posted by cshama
I love guns but it is insane to let any idiot buy a 9mm or AR15
The idiots should be restricted to .45 and 7.62.
A:
Unfortunately, more gun laws, with some common sense exceptions, won't help. They certainly would not have saved the Amish kids.
You can pass a law restricting, or even banning, gravity, but that won't keep you from landing on your ass if you fall.
Given our history and the sheer mountain of firearms in the United States, there is absolutely no way to keep guns out of the hands of criminals, the deranged, or even the irresponsible.
Since guns are a fact of life in our society, it behoves us to do all we can to change the culture of violence. What we need, what will actually work, is a war on the root causes of all violence; poverty, under-education, and political and civic leadership that fails to condem our wild-west attitude.
Of course these approaches don't lend themselves to convenient sound bytes and they take a very long time to come to fruition. American people are not noted for embracing long-term approaches.
What we need immediately is adequate funding for our courts and prisons with vigorous law enforcement against bad guys with guns. I'd love to see a "surtax" on committing a felony while in possession of a firearm. An additional twenty-five years, not subject to parole or early release would at least warehouse our problem until a civil society can emerge.
It's very obvious that guns aren't the problem; other countries have plenty of guns but far less gun crime because their societies are simply more civilized. There is plenty of blame to go around; every thing from a cowboy president to our kids' video games.
Best regards to all,
Leo
A:
was thread about gun control?
pics of old guy please.
A:
Originally Posted by DeathWish
What we need immediately is adequate funding for our courts and prisons with vigorous law enforcement against bad guys with guns.
No argument with that.
I'd love to see a "surtax" on committing a felony while in possession of a firearm.
We already have that in most states. Unfortunately, it is seldom enforced by the police or the courts. Instead of enforcing the existing laws, many people seem to push the agenda of banning guns instead of prosecuting the criminals that use them (using the existing laws).
A:
Originally Posted by Shiftlock
I'm also one who isn't really into the "perfection" of my car, but judging by a lot of the posts on ET, I would said I'm in the minority. As a stereotype, Elise owners seem almost obcessive about the clenliness of their cars. This goes back to the original topic of the thread. A few finger prints aren't a big deal to me at all, although people touching my car still bothers me for some reason.
Then you and I stand for the minority vote. After track days, I leave the tire black (from spit-up marbles) on the starshield for, well... almost indefinitely. I figure why clean it off, if I'm just going to get more in a week? My credo is to keep the car in perfect mechanical condition, but if were to obsess over concours-level cleanliness, I would just go insane.
A:
Oh, and someone makes a great point about the wisdom of shooting-to-kill the assailant with the baseball bat -- that the victim could have wrestled the bat away from the bad guy, and that shooting the bat-wielder could lead to a terrible mistake.
I believe that a civilian's use of deadly force should follow the same policy of law enforcement's use of deadly force, and in this case, wouldn't the police at least fire a warning shot, or give a verbal warning to drop the bat? And if that didn't work, wing the bat-weilder in the leg before firing in the chest?
Yes? No?
A:
Originally Posted by JonOrangeElise
I believe that a civilian's use of deadly force should follow the same policy of law enforcement's use of deadly force, and in this case, wouldn't the police at least fire a warning shot, or give a verbal warning to drop the bat? And if that didn't work, wing the bat-weilder in the leg before firing in the chest?
Yes? No?
No. If you got within 20 feet of a cop with a bat, the cop would shoot to kill. Cops don't "wing" bad guys in the leg or arm except in the movies. It's a virtually impossible shot. Deadly force is deadly force. No gray areas. "Warning shots" are also just from the movies. No such thing in real life. The cops will tell you to drop your weapon. But, if you don't, and you approach them... You will "commit suicide by cop."
Mike
A:
Originally Posted by fastliz
No. If you got within 20 feet of a cop with a bat, the cop would shoot to kill. Cops don't "wing" bad guys in the leg or arm except in the movies. It's a virtually impossible shot. Deadly force is deadly force. No gray areas. "Warning shots" are also just from the movies. No such thing in real life. The cops will tell you to drop your weapon. But, if you don't, and you approach them... You will "commit suicide by cop."
Mike
Agreed.
A:
Originally Posted by RegGuy
It's the Archie Bunker theorem, give everyone guns so the crooks are out numbered.
I live in a really low crime area and there are a ton of hunters around. I'm not sure I can say the two correlate, but...
"Would it make you feel any bettah little goil if dey wiz pushed outta windiz?"
One of my favorite lines.
A:
Originally Posted by tandemracer
If more people had guns fewer cretins would try to steal cars.
Originally Posted by cshama
Tell that to the Amish schoolkids gunned down by the Lawabiding milkman who owned quite a few legal guns.
I love guns but it is insane to let any idiot buy a 9mm or AR15
You'd have to rephrase it for the Amish: If more people had guns fewer cretins would try to steal horses.
Seriously thopugh, The Amish had no weapons, but the Milkman did. Therefore they could not do anything about his rampage. I think that's what tandemracer meant.
A:
Originally Posted by fastliz
No. If you got within 20 feet of a cop with a bat, the cop would shoot to kill. Cops don't "wing" bad guys in the leg or arm except in the movies. It's a virtually impossible shot. Deadly force is deadly force. No gray areas. "Warning shots" are also just from the movies. No such thing in real life. The cops will tell you to drop your weapon. But, if you don't, and you approach them... You will "commit suicide by cop."
Mike
Steve Foley (San Diego Charger Linebacker) got a warning shot into the bushes then shot in the leg and wrist. I would say any NFL player coming at me doesn't matter what is in his hands, but then I would not have a gun in mine. I would have stayed in my car and let Motorola solve the problem. That night on the town already cost him $3/4Mil.
A:
Originally Posted by CALtd
Steve Foley (San Diego Charger Linebacker) got a warning shot into the bushes then shot in the leg and wrist. I would say any NFL player coming at me doesn't matter what is in his hands, but then I would not have a gun in mine. I would have stayed in my car and let Motorola solve the problem. That night on the town already cost him $3/4Mil.
If a cop hits a perp in the wrist, leg, arm, pinky toe, or any other area besides "center mass" (middle of torso)... He MISSED.
Mike
A:
Originally Posted by fastliz
No. If you got within 20 feet of a cop with a bat, the cop would shoot to kill. Cops don't "wing" bad guys in the leg or arm except in the movies. It's a virtually impossible shot. Deadly force is deadly force. No gray areas. "Warning shots" are also just from the movies. No such thing in real life. The cops will tell you to drop your weapon. But, if you don't, and you approach them... You will "commit suicide by cop."
Mike
You missed my point. I know that if you move on a cop with a bat, you will be shot at with deadly force. (C'mon -- wasn't born yesterday!) I am asking what would a cop do if he happened upon a scene wherein one person was beating another with a baseball bat. Would he begin shooting the aggressor with deadly force with no warning? I don't believe so, but I wouldn't mind an expert to weigh in.
Raggedy -- you're a cop, yes? Can you weigh in?
A:
Originally Posted by JonOrangeElise
You missed my point. I know that if you move on a cop with a bat, you will be shot at with deadly force. (C'mon -- wasn't born yesterday!) I am asking what would a cop do if he happened upon a scene wherein one person was beating another with a baseball bat. Would he begin shooting the aggressor with deadly force with no warning? I don't believe so, but I wouldn't mind an expert to weigh in.
Raggedy -- you're a cop, yes? Can you weigh in?
A verbal warning may or may not happen, but in your scenario I would expect an officer to use deadly force without waiting to see if the assailant is going to stop pummeling his victim.
A:
Originally Posted by Raindem
A verbal warning may or may not happen, but in your scenario I would expect an officer to use deadly force without waiting to see if the assailant is going to stop pummeling his victim.
No "stop immediately or I'll shoot"?
A:
Back on subject- I dont think any violence at all is warranted if you find someone sitting in your car without permission. I think it is more weird then anything else. All this talk of hurting or killing someone for sitting in or even stealing your car is just moronic.
Let me tell you, if you hurt someone doing that and you came to a court where I was a judge I would put you in jail for a significant amout of time. Thats what insurance and the police are for. ITS ONLY A CAR GUYS.......
A:
Originally Posted by JonOrangeElise
No "stop immediately or I'll shoot"?
In the time it takes to say that he's delivered 2 more blows.
A:
Originally Posted by GaryD
Going back to the original content of the thread - I absolutely agree with and understand all your reactions to the idiot in the car but, two things:
1) I would not stop parking in the lot because there was one idiot who thought he should be allowed to climb into someone else's car. The whole neighborhood should not be tarred with the same brush. He's probably the only person in the area who thinks he should be able to act that way and now you've seen him you can guarantee he's not going near your car again. So I would go back and eat a couple of almond croissants today
2) I never park in two spaces. It makes me mad when I am cruising around looking for a spot and somebody thinks their car / paint job is so much more valuable than the rest of us they can selfishly take two spots. If I can't find a space it fills my head with thoughts of keying their damn paint (I don't do it - but I think others would). It's very selfsh to do that. As the lot fills up you run even more of a risk of this happening. Park in an end spot - look for spaces next to cars that are not going to have kids or overweight, thoughtless adults swing the doors into your car by all means, but don't take two spots - you WILL make others mad and you WILL attract more negative attention to your car. In fact I would park near the bakery so the car is not isolated. The Elise is narrow waisted and other car doors have more room to open next to it in a lot of cases - mine has not been dinged yet and is a daily driver, grocery shopper etc etc.
... I think I'll go get some coffee and pastries now - but I will be going to a lower end establishment - Dunkin Donuts
I greatly appreciate your attempt to bring this topic back on track (more than you’ll ever know). However, you didn't read the whole thread (or at least before it became a gun debate
Had you read it, you'd know that ...
1) I had another interesting event happen in that same parking lot with a different guy
2) Those days I didn't take up 2 spots.
Besides I'm not going to justify taking up 2 spots to park in this thread. I do it when I'm way at the back of the lot and there are no other cars within 20 yards of mine and I can't park near a curb. The people who are flipping out about it really need to stop the lecture and just lighten up a small bit. I’m not killing anyone by parking in two spaces, relax.
I WILL NOT BE POSTING A PICTURE OF THE GUY WHO DID IT. I'm not about to be bullied online by what seems to me more and more to be some pretty extremist attitudes. If I wanted to pursue the man I would have done so in court, not online. I thought I'd share an odd story and maybe open up some similar situations.
A:
Originally Posted by cshama
Back on subject- I dont think any violence at all is warranted if you find someone sitting in your car without permission. I think it is more weird then anything else. All this talk of hurting or killing someone for sitting in or even stealing your car is just moronic.
Let me tell you, if you hurt someone doing that and you came to a court where I was a judge I would put you in jail for a significant amout of time. Thats what insurance and the police are for. ITS ONLY A CAR GUYS.......
Thank you!