A&Q about 350Z
Q:
i was just out in the shop, and there was some muriatic acid out there.
so i thought i'd see what it would clean, and what it would destroy.
works GREAT on rusted tools. i put a 3/8 wobble socket that HAD lots of rust on it, and frozen solid in the muriatic for just a few minutes,,,and it looked BRAND NEW. the chrome was untouched.
the metal straps on fuel rails comes out perfect too.
the original wire-type hose clamps come out BEAUTIFUL!!! AMAZING result.
i tossed in a throttle body,,,it almost boiled over. turns aluminum black. interesting finish.
anyone heard of this before?
-----------------
Some of you were born on third base. Don't try and act like you hit a triple.
A:
It turns aluminum black because it oxides the surface very quickly. Careful when working with HCl, it's nasty stuff.
A:
yeah they use it at the detail part of the dealership, they thin it out a lot to use on aluminum wheels. gotta wash it quick.
82 NA 5 spd
77 4 spd
A:
Make sure you oil those tools afterwards, else they rust 10x worse 100x faster.
A:
A long time ago I poured some in a gas tank from a motorcycle. I didn't dilute it as recommended and left it in all night thinking more is better. The next morning when I came out was a little Kodak moment as it had eaten away the bottom of the tank. Careful with that stuff.
John
77280Z (Spooky), 83ZXT (Garage Queen), 86ZXT (Bulldog).
Proud owner of 10/03 Z car of the month.
A:
Even diluted it's still just as reactive.
Just say no.
A:
It works great to eat the rust from parts however, it also eats the metal if exposed too long. It will remove the plating from cad and zinc plate parts. The wonderful finish you saw on the wire hose clamps was the bare metal. It will rust very fast from the moisture in the air if not replated or painted quickly. If you are going to use it to clean parts, dilute at least 2:1 and it should be 5:1. This way it will get the deeper rust without being so bad for the other metal. Muratic acid will dissolve aluminum, so don't put your aluminum parts in it at all. Also, pot metal Zinc will be dissolved (probably what your throttle ody is made form and why it boiled so much). Use with lots of ventilation and keep it covered. It will cause everything else around it to rust within a couple hours from the fumes. BTW, it works faster if it's warm.
1972 240Z 4-speed, header, 3.54 R200, Crane XR-3000 Ignition, 280Z tach, Tokico Blue Struts, Suspension Tech Springs, Poly Bushings. Visit me at my website for your custom EFI & restored Datsun parts
A:
Probably best to use it for etching concrete before painting that garage floor.
73 240Z - Nissan Sport project car
A:
Sounds like lethal stuff!
Be careful Evil, maybe use something a bit safer and less toxic, we don't want you to be growing an extra head any time soon.
Post Edited (Oct 31, 19:19pm)
A:
Works really good at pissing your wife off for getting it all over your clothes and towels. Next time I follow one of Blues tech tips and he says use heavy plastic, I wont mistake that for being able to tape a few "baggies" around a gas tanks openings. Oh ya, wear suitable gloves when handling that stuff, it really puts a sting on any scrapes you may have across your hands.
A:
I have alway wanted to take a gallon of it and poor it all over a car to see what it does.
-1981 280zx
-89 Jeep Cherokee
F-54 - N-47 - 9.8:1 comp - 6-3-1 header -Schneider (470 lift, 280 dur.) - full 2 1/4 exhaust- Pallnet fuel rail - 6 puck ceramic clutch
A:
It won't do anything to the paint. It's not that strong. It will eat the rust out of the scratches though. Will also dissolve the aluminum wheels and take off any zinc plating on the car. It doesn't remove paint very well. The parts have to be in the acid a really long time for the paint to come loose. If there is rust under the paint, it will get it off that way though. Also if the paint is thin and full of pinholes. I use it all the time for parts before I replate them. It takes the old zinc plating off really well. Just have to be carefull where you use it.
1972 240Z 4-speed, header, 3.54 R200, Crane XR-3000 Ignition, 280Z tach, Tokico Blue Struts, Suspension Tech Springs, Poly Bushings. Visit me at my website for your custom EFI & restored Datsun parts
A:
"It won't do anything to the paint. It's not that strong"
A complete misunderstanding.
Even diluted, hydrochloric acid is a strong acid. Dilutioun does not affect reactivity.
Paint requires a solvent, not a water based acid mix, to be removed.
A:
Muratic Acid is only PART HCL. It's not as strong as hydrochloric. I've had painted items in the acid tank for hours and not had the paint come loose that didn't have corrosion underneath it. It's NOT a paint remover.
1972 240Z 4-speed, header, 3.54 R200, Crane XR-3000 Ignition, 280Z tach, Tokico Blue Struts, Suspension Tech Springs, Poly Bushings. Visit me at my website for your custom EFI & restored Datsun parts
A:
"Muratic Acid is only PART HCL."
I give, what's the OTHER PART?
Diluting acid does NOT change how reactive it is (chemistry 101).
A:
Water
Injector Cleaning Service
THE FREE ONLINE INDEPENDENT Z STORE
Email me to add your product
A:
Diluting acid does NOT change how reactive it is (chemistry 101).
So 1 HCL molecule in 1,000,0000,0000,000 litres of water is very reactive?
hehehehe
your long lost brother!
Injector Cleaning Service
THE FREE ONLINE INDEPENDENT Z STORE
Email me to add your product
A:
"So 1 HCL molecule in 1,000,0000,0000,000 litres of water is very reactive?"
Damn right that one HCl molecule is just as reactive as any other, it has to be. You're confusing reactivity with concentration.
A:
I am refering to the reactivity of the total solution, not just a molecule within it.
Injector Cleaning Service
THE FREE ONLINE INDEPENDENT Z STORE
Email me to add your product
A:
Hydrochloric acid, or muriatic acid by its historical but still occasionally used name, has been an important and frequently used chemical from early history and was discovered by the alchemist Jabir ibn Hayyan around the year 800.
The chemical compound hydrochloric acid is the aqueous (water-based) solution of hydrogen chloride (HCl). It is a strong acid, the major component of gastric acid and of wide industrial use. Hydrochloric acid should only be handled with appropriate safety precautions because it is a highly corrosive liquid.
Hydrochloric acid is produced in solutions up to 38% HCl (concentrated grade). Higher concentrations up to just over 40% are chemically possible, but the evaporation rate is then so high that storage and handling need extra precautions, such as pressure and low temperature. Bulk industrial-grade is therefore 30% to 34%, optimized for effective transport and limited product loss by HCl vapours. Solutions for household purposes, mostly cleaning, are typically 10% to 12%, with strong recommendations to dilute before use.
Hydrochloric acid in high concentrations forms acidic mists. Both the mist and the solution have a corrosive effect on human tissue, potentially damaging respiratory organs, eyes, skin and intestines. Upon mixing hydrochloric acid with common oxidizing chemicals, such as bleach (NaClO) or permanganate (KMnO4), the toxic gas chlorine is produced. To minimize the risks while working with hydrochloric acid, appropriate precautions should be taken. For example, water should never be added to the concentrated acid, as the water could boil; rather, acid should be added to water.
source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hydrochloric_acid
83 280ZXT w/Tokico HP Struts & Springs, U-Bushings, MSA Sway Bars, Strut Tower Bars, CAI w/K&N, 3" Exhaust, B&M Short Throw Shifter, HKS IC, 12psi, GReddy POV & Profec B-II EBC.
A:
! where can i purchase the stuff?
73' 240z: F54 4.2L, OS Giken LY DOHC Crossflow head, 17:3comp.ratio, N33, Tripple SU's, T10 Hybrid Draw-Through TT @ 47pds, Roots&Centrifugal Type supercharger, 3-2-1 headers, Centerforce 4 clutch, 6oz flywheel, R300 differential, Super-Hicas
A:
"I am refering to the reactivity of the total solution, not just a molecule within it."
Reactivity of the solution is identical. Like I said, you're confusing reaction rates with concentration.
A:
Hybrid77Z is right: You can reduce concentration through adding water, but the reactivity of the acid itself stays the same.
Muriatic acid is hydrochloric acid. They are the same thing.
A:
probably a home improvement store. Lowe's, Builders Supply, Home Depot, etc....
Masons and builders use it to clean residue from bricks, blocks, stones, concrete, etc...
I think most of the wheel cleaners on the market contain some concentration of muriatic acid. I use the ArmorAll brand routinely.
78 280Z Daily Driver
All original, Stock engine, Auto Trans w/factory A/C, 205,000 miles, new suspension and bushing kit, under primer and saving for a paint job.......
83 ZX w/T Tops, purchased 4-20-06, 122K miles, Son's restoration project
Post Edited (Nov 6, 1:26pm)
A:
thx dawg
73' 240z: F54 4.2L, OS Giken LY DOHC Crossflow head, 17:3comp.ratio, N33, Tripple SU's, T10 Hybrid Draw-Through TT @ 47pds, Roots&Centrifugal Type supercharger, 3-2-1 headers, Centerforce 4 clutch, 6oz flywheel, R300 differential, Super-Hicas
A:
whatever you do.... READ ALL CONTAINERS DIRECTIONS...and wear eye protection (goggles) ....long sleve shirt....and avoid breathing vapor/mist!!!!!!!!
A:
teenagers use it to blow things up.
Mans Prayer "I'm a man.... But I can change..... If I have too...... I guess"
No matter how good she looks, some other guy is sick and tired of putting up with her.
A:
"Even diluted it's still just as reactive."
Explain this, for all intentional purposes, if I use 1 teaspoon of Muriatic Acid to clean my fuel tank it will do the same job as say, using 1 Gallon? I think that is the confustion, a scientific solution that doesnt work in the everyday world. If thats the case, how long would it take to clean a whole fuel tank with one teaspoon? And how long would it take to clean that same fuel tank with 1 gallon? Reactivity and concentration is all fine for the bookworms, but a guy trying to clean a fuel tank might need a little more logical response. Sometimes in the everyday world it doesnt pay to try to be too smart, just gotta knuckle down and do it. If Im wrong please correct me, but it sure seems like your trying to equate it this way, and I just dont see the working mans logic behind it.
A:
Oh btw, most Home Depots and stuff dont even carry it no more. Prolly depends on where you live. Its sold alot for pool systems, for PH balance or some cleaning type of deal. I had to go to 3 Home Depots out here in Denver just to find it, safe to say we really dont have alot of home pools. If you have any problems finding it, try a pool cleaning supply store. Just walk in and tell them you want to cook up a batch of meth, theyll point you in the right direction lol.
A:
This is the definition Hybrid is going by:
"The relative capacity of an atom, molecule, or radical to undergo a chemical reaction with another atom, molecule, or compound."
Meaning, regardless of how much acid you have (or how diluted it is) the term reactivity refers to indiviual molecules or atoms.
So your right, doesn't mean sh!t to the working man.
--------------------------------------
1990 300zx NA
- Custom Exhaust
- JWT Pop Charger
Post Edited (Nov 6, 2:15pm)
A:
"a scientific solution that doesnt work in the everyday world. "
THAT has got to be the funniest damn thing I have seen written in a long time. The reactivity is exactly the same, dilution only moves the highly reactive HCl molecules further appart. HCl remains HCl until it reacts.
A:
ACETONE......little more rubbing, but leaves the cad plating intact
A:
posts about what happened after everyone saying "Gee" right now goes out and commences dipping their car parts into this newly identified wonder fluid.
A:
Here let me drop in on this fantastic chemical conversation.
Yes concentration and reactivity are two different things but concentration is what really matters.
I don't give a crap how one molecule reacts with my skin - I care how many of those molecules I am going to have to endure.
So, even bringing up the topic of reactivity being the same is simply for imflammatory purposes in this conversation.
1993 300zx NA
A:
hybrid likes to focus on one specific detail and argue it like it's the only thing that matters.
_____________________________________________
'05 350Z Chrome Silver Touring
'73 240Z
A:
Author: z32d00d said, "You can reduce concentration through adding water"
NO, you do NOT add water to HCl to reduce concentration. You add HCl to water. Yes, it does make a difference. To add water to HCl, you are risking boiling and that's not a good thing. Do it the other way and you will be safer.
Concentration and Reactivity are not the same thing. You can't change the reactivity, but you can change the concentration and that's what you are interested in for the sake of the above conversation.
Man do I hate chemistry. At least HCl isn't organic. Ugh.
83 280ZXT w/Tokico HP Struts & Springs, U-Bushings, MSA Sway Bars, Strut Tower Bars, CAI w/K&N, 3" Exhaust, B&M Short Throw Shifter, HKS IC, 12psi, GReddy POV & Profec B-II EBC.
A:
justinrhenry, I use precise meanings and specific examples.
The argument comes when others can't grasp the simple.
A:
People grasp what your saying, and thank you for the better understanding. Now I know that I can clean my entire fuel tank with 1 Teaspoon of Muriatic Acid.
A:
jeese,some of you have WAAAAY too much time on your hands.
A:
>NO, you do NOT add water to HCl to reduce concentration. You add HCl
> to water.
Yes yes, I know. This is the same reason you have to be careful mixing sulfuric acid. But remember, when you have a pre-diluted over-the-counter solution of HCl, you can probably mix water directly into it (wearing the proper equipment).
>Concentration and Reactivity are not the same thing. You can't change
> the reactivity, but you can change the concentration
That's what I said. You can reduce concentration, but not reactivity.
The practical application is that increasing the amount of water in the solution of HCl will decrease the concentration, thus lessening the acidic effects of the solution. HCl is usually sold in less than 30% concentration.
A:
Author: Hybrid77Z
Date: Nov 7, 8:12pm
justinrhenry, I use precise meanings and specific examples.
The argument comes when others can't grasp the simple.
I know that's your goal. I've seen it backfire on you a few times. Makes for good entertainment.
_____________________________________________
'05 350Z Chrome Silver Touring
'73 240Z
A:
Yea, best way to start an argument here is to be precise and give specific examples. It is ammusing.
A:
nerds
73' 240z: F54 4.2L, OS Giken LY DOHC Crossflow head, 17:3comp.ratio, N33, Tripple SU's, T10 Hybrid Draw-Through TT @ 47pds, Roots&Centrifugal Type supercharger, 3-2-1 headers, Centerforce 4 clutch, 6oz flywheel, R300 differential, Super-Hicas
A:
^Ahahaha, I don't think your in ANY position to call someone else a nerd.
Case in point:
I'm not even gonna comment on Hybrid...I like posting here...
--------------------------------------
1990 300zx NA
- Custom Exhaust
- JWT Pop Charger
A:
nice......I second that Iceman
Clean your parts with parts cleaner, Acetone, or Brake Cleaner depending on the part
A:
MUAHAHAHAHA
73' 240z: F54 4.2L, OS Giken LY DOHC Crossflow head, 17:3comp.ratio, N33, Tripple SU's, T10 Hybrid Draw-Through TT @ 47pds, Roots&Centrifugal Type supercharger, 3-2-1 headers, Centerforce 4 clutch, 6oz flywheel, R300 differential, Super-Hicas
A:
Muriatic Acid can be found at any pool supply store. It is routinely added to pools. I have a 6 gallon bucket next to my house with 50/50 mix of Muriatic acid / water. I use it to clean the calcium buildup from my saltwater reef aquarium parts when I do the monthly maintenance.
It dissolves calcium build-up off plastic and leaves things looking like new. The trick to using the blend is to rinse immediatley in a soapy water solution. The soap neutralizes the acid. Then rinse with fresh water and you're done. I've used the blend to clean concrete, in a more diluted form of course.
I recently removed my stock I/C's from the Z and after giving them a fin straightening and inernal alcohol rinse I submerged them in my 50/50 bucket. The bubbled for a few seconds, then I removed them and submerged them a soapy water solution (my carwash bucket) then gave them a rinse. They look almost new with no damage to the aluminum.
I've used that solution for more stuff than you would think, the rust trick mentioned above works well. Use a cotton swap to apply the mix to surface rust or rust in a scratch and then clean and prep as normal for paint.
I have a few mods