A&Q about 350Z
Q:
Hi,
I've read that I can convert the 2.0 16v 9a engine to 2.1 by using a diesel crank. Is this true?
IF SO, What exact crank and mods will be needed?
I need to replace my tired 1.8 16v (190k on clock) mk2 engine and want to build something nice.
Can I used any of the 2.0 16v bottom ends as fitted to the mk3 golf, passat, audi?
Thanks
Martin
A:
Hi,
I've read that I can convert the 2.0 16v 9a engine to 2.1 by using a diesel crank. Is this true?
IF SO, What exact crank and mods will be needed?
I need to replace my tired 1.8 16v (190k on clock) mk2 engine and want to build something nice.
Can I used any of the 2.0 16v bottom ends as fitted to the mk3 golf, passat, audi?
Thanks
Martin
go standard 2L (1984cc)as used in the Corrado, passat, golf 3 and audi 80(long-ways with different sump and inlet manifold), this will be smooth and revvy, the overbore and long throw cranks to take it over 2L just make the rev range more limited and gain you a tiny bit more torque, plenty of 170bhp+ 1984cc cars around, can get close to 190/200 with the right headwork and cams.
A:
No no no no no! A 2.1 does rev!!!!!!
A:
And there's no substitute for cubic inches,
I WANT TO BUILD ONE!
A:
you need a tall block ideally rod ratio in a 9a ia a bit pants with the 2.1
A:
Now thats bloody true, forgot about that little bit of info.
A:
Is it really worth all the extra hassle/cost for something less than 100cc over a 1984cc 9A though....
Rather like a large capacity 8v, you are gonna need some proper headwork to let it rev properly..
Id be inclined to go 2L & use the money saved on diesel crank etc etc towards tuning it
A:
It was good enough for the Reeves boys, and the extra cost is minimal really, in comparison to buying throttle bodies, when you can pick up a cheap set of 45's that work really well with the extra torque.
Swings and roundabouts, but it's not that much extra to do it.
A:
my 2042cc 16v, Blydenstein Stage 1 head (mods to inlet only, std valves) Schrick 260/260 cams (nice and mild) K-jet with WUR mod, stainless exhaust, std manifold, 2042 bottom end (diesel crank and std 82.5mm pistons -just machined)
Notice how below 6k rpm it has a whole load of torque - even compared to some serious money engines. I never ran it with hotter cams - but you can reasonably expect more power at higher revs with more headwork (remember exhaust side was std and untouched) and hotter cams.
A:
Each to their own i guess, but im still not convinced....what extra torque? LOL
Not revvy enough for my liking with 260's...& maybe 5lbs/ft up on the others between 4K & 5750rpm.
What was gained in torque below 6K was offset by the fact it peaked & tailed off much sooner. The difference in the top end of the graph would surely give a different feel to the reviness of the motor as well??
Hotter cams would lose that torque advantage lower down, but allow it to rev a bit better.........so swings & roundabouts indeed!!! Not sure what the net gain would be though....
A:
When my old 2042 was at TSR the same day as your wwn 2 litre it was only about 4 bhp less. I know your own map was a bit pants, but at the same time, my bottom end cost me £300.
I was also running standard cams and my own headwork with a standard manifold. So the net gain was pretty damn convincing when you think of it in terms of money spent.
It would rev to the limit easily and strongly, and that was using the k-ket.
So now add to that some throttle bodies and some cams.......
You get my drift
Quick reminder:
Extra torque between 4-6k, it's there, and would probably improve on carbs or bodies.
A:
I remember well, a strong motor indeed Was it 168atw best run after a tweak?, certainly compared favourably with all the other K-Jets
Thing being is the spec of my motor isnt particularly massive as its not an all out track motor (standard compression, softish cams for TB use, standard bottom end etc etc) hence peak power figures are not massively different from the top K-Jet cars...& yes the map wasnt particularly good. Certainly I have scope for the future to build a bigger spec engine, but until such time the poor old TB's will have their critics..RobT's motor is an example of what is do-able
I went to TSR again subsequently & got 175atw again, then returned after the remap & it did 180atw.
This compared to a "real world" 193atfw & 163 atw the previous week when mapped on a Dyno Dynamics RR...
The big story was the new map moved peak all the way from 6800 to 7300, & it held the peak to 7650, So another 500+ usable RPM effectively. Sadly the antiquated TSR rollers couldnt show this
If i were to go high comp (more than 11:1 ) with some hotter cams etc etc then it would undoubtedly allow the bodies to come into there own as this would be well into the area where K-Jet would begin to struggle...& the power would climb again
Need to go up to Stealth again really, & see what a proper map has done for the car & get a plot that can be compared to the K-Jet cars
A:
I'm off to raid the scrappies tomoz morning :)
So long as I can collect the parts for the bottom end I'll be happy. That way it can all be sent of to be machined and balanced which will take a few weeks.
I've decided I want to go the 2042cc route, is there any specific parts I should avoid?
As of the moment I'm looking for any diesel mk2 golf crank and a 9a 2.0 block (which i believe may be hard to find?). Would the 6a 2.0 block work as well?
What cars used the ABF block (sorry bit of a novice on these codes and numbers!)
Cheers
Mart
A:
Don't use the 9a block, the rod ratio will be a bit crap when using a longer stroke, thats why the tall block ABF is more favourable.
MK3 16v uses the ABF and also the Seat 16v's(cordoba etc)
As for the cranks, try and get one from a 1y engine.
A:
Would the 9a or 6a blocks work with ABF rods? Or am I making things harder here!
(Knowing all the options will help if the breakers dont have eactly what I'm after)
Also 1y diesel cranks are these found in anything other than the mk2 golf 1800?
Can I use the standard 2.0 VW 16v pistons with this conversion, I don't want to have to buy new ones (budget ha ha)
Cheers
Mart
A:
the ABF block and rods are (IIRC) 16mm taller/longer than the 9a - hence the better rod/stroke ratio with the longer stroke crank
My Dyno plot was not supposed to suggest that it was the best engine ever created - merely that with a lesser spec head, lesser spec cams, much more std fuelling and std manifold it was able to produce figures comparable with engines that were built to a higher spec.
For less money too.
A:
I asked Vince at Stealth about 2.1 16v conversions once.
He said you might as well have an 8v. His favorite gti motor is the 16v because "it revs".
A high revving 1.9 is quite nice but works out a lot more than buying a second hand 2 litre.
I'd say just stick a 2 litre in it and enjoy the cainage.
A:
Might as well buy an 8v.......hmm, my old 2042 would woop some serious 8v ass
Nah, honestly, if you fancy something a little different, and your doing it on a budget, then it ain't a bad conversion. You really do notice the low end grunt. My mk1 will loose grip on the slightest shove of the pedal in low revs. 5th is pretty good too, no need to change down to accelerate, although the weight difference of the mk1 does help.
As soon as it's setup I'll get a vid up.
At the mo it won't rev over 5K, and stutters like a b itch.The timing has got to be out as the dizzy is on the stop just to get it to run half decently.
A:
Hey,
Will elongating the slots in the distributor body get you engough advance on it?
Well my trip the scrappies wasn't very fruitful. There were a few audi's but none of them were valvers and no diesel or mk3 golfs.
I have been offered a diesel crank, anyone got an abf block, pistons and rods for sale?
Cheers
Mart
A:
you want to setup megajolt (DIY 3D Mapable ignition system) to sort your timing out! improved mine 8v no end. cost about £150 in parts and has built in rev limitor and programmable outputs and adjusted via a lap top.
A:
Hi
I'm still stuggling to find an abf block for my conversion!
Hotgolf said the rod ratio is better in the abf engine BUT does anyone know if I can use a 9a or 6a block, pistons, rods with the diesel crank to get 2045cc??
If this will work one of the plus's will be no block height issued with exhaust and manifolds.
I can't find much info on this conversion on-line...
Thanks
Martin
A:
you can but the engine life will be reduced over an ABF with the same conversion, could use a mk3 8v block tho
A:
Is the reliability an issue due to the wall thickness of the block on the 9a, 6a ones??
I didn't think any 8v blocks and the 16v KR head were compatible?
What I need is a definative list of how I can achieve the 2045cc and what parts are needed to do it, anyone fancy making 'The List' for me?
Thanks
A:
it's not the thickness that's a problem, it's the angle of the conrods in the bore moves the torque around and gives the bearings a harder time....having said that it'd be fine unless you want to keep it forever
A:
UPDATE...
I have a lovely mk3 2.0 8v bottom end, and a 80k (PL code) 16v head, the mate up fine.The KR intermediate shaft fit the mk3 block fine.
Now onto the crank my question is....
Why is the 1Y diesel crank the one to use? Is it because the crank cam pulley has the same fitment as the 16v?
I have a choice of a 1Y crank, an unknown early style one and a AAZ code engine (m reg) and I don't know which one to go for....
Thanks in advance
Martin